which OS

I purchased a used computer. For $40 it isn’t what I really would like, but it seems probably adequate to run Audition and various other software I have ben unable to touch for years  (it is a cobbled together collection of parts from a guy who buys non-functioning computers cheap, then fixes them, or uses the parts of several to make one “good” one.)

Right now it is running 64 bit Windows 7 Ultimate and seems to be doing well However, this is the same cracked OS version the guy installs on many of his creations. To remake the computer  into something I can really use, I will need to purchase my own copy of an appropriate OS. Getting the money for Audition is another matter, best left to the future.

For years I have wanted a WinXP system but now that I have something capable of running it, I’m not sure if Windows 7 wouldn’t be a better idea. While I haven’t been following the story, an update to Audition is apparently in the works. If this is so, it will almost certainly be written for Windows 7, or whatever comes next from MS.

According to the M-Audio web site, Audiophile 2496 drivers are available for Windows 7. If I get an OME version from a local small computer shop when I buy a second hard drive for this “new” machine (2005 date on the MB), WinXP Home and Windows 7 Home are both the same, relatively low, price. Is there any good audio related reason to chose XP over 7?

Provided that all your hardware and software will work under Windows 7, I'd go for it.

James.

WinXP Home and Windows 7 Home are both the same, relatively low, price. Is there any good audio related reason to chose XP over 7?

None whatsoever - Win 7 is the future and is a far better, more stable and professional OS than XP (and I loved XP). Almost everything is better in 7 - the driver handling is brilliant, it is small and efficient, it doesn't crash and it makes great use of the hardware. I hvae no hesitation at all in saying "GET WIN 7 RIGHT NOW!!!" 

I see MarkT has posted very positively on Win7 while I was writing. I will still post this, as there it contains at least one question of considerable interest to me.

I don’t know if that is actually much of a criteria. The expectation that much of my software will not work was a big negative factor against a newer OS well before money was the main issue. There are a number of programs that I use fairly often, and would hope to continue using, but for years now I have been running into newer software, including much freeware, that does not work under Win98. The desire to run Audition, and a number of these other programs, is the main reason for a new computer.

I already know that some of my long time programs don’t seem to work or even install but I know too little about any OS after Win98 to know if there might be a way around some of the problems. The main question is audio recording, and processing in general. I don’t have the impression that it is as difficult as under Vista but I haven’t been following what other people are doing with something I couldn’t afford.

Speaking of Audition. I know it used to be possible to upgrade from CoolEdit rather than pay for a completely new package but I see the Adobe ordering page just says something like “any earlier version of Audition.” Do they include CE2K in that definition or is CoolEdit now left out of the deal?

Having my soundcard function is a big factor and I probably should stick it in place for a trial. It is just that it is such a pain to get it out of the other box that I haven’t managed yet. As I wrote above, M-Audio has the drivers ready. I was hoping for some comments from others Audiophile 2496 users. I would also like to be able to install, and use, the pci SCSI card for my scanner, but no other hardware is likely to make the leap into the other box.

Speaking of Audition. I know it used to be possible to upgrade from CoolEdit rather than pay for a completely new package but I see the Adobe ordering page just says something like “any earlier version of Audition.” Do they include CE2K in that definition or is CoolEdit now left out of the deal?

Since there is no part of the definition or meaning of 'Cool Edit Two Thousand' that contains the word 'Audition', I think that you will find that 'any earlier version of Audition' means exactly what it says - no more, no less. So their upgrade policy means Audition 1, 1.5, or 2.0 and nothing earlier.

And regardless of any eulogising, I think that you will find that on any given set of indifferent  hardware, in terms of the speed of processing overall, XP generally  out-performs W7{any version}. But nobody can tell you absolutely how well your particular hardware will work with W7 compared to XP, because you haven't specified anything at all about it. For instance, on an indifferent machine there's a very good chance that Audition will perform significantly differently depending on whether it has an Intel or an AMD processor; all of the FFT routines have been optimised for Intel, and that's rather more processing than you might think.

And just because a manufacturer has produced a W7 driver for their product doesn't suddenly mean that everything will be wonderful - many of these drivers are still early editions and not as stable as their mature XP ones. This doesn't mean that they won't get there - just that newer does not automatically mean better.

XP is stable now, and a known quantity. So you have to ask yourself whether there is anything in W7 that you absolutely need to have in W7 before you commit to it. There have been all sorts of nebulous complaints about W7 64-bit and Audition; some people get on fine with it, and others have all sorts of difficulties - there are a lot of these sorts of reports on the Adobe forum, and quite frankly they are rather hard to tie down to anything specific - except that a lot of people seem to have difficulty recording streaming audio from the internet, one way or another. I strongly suspect that Microsoft are behind this, but it's hard to pin down some of these problems. W7 32-bit seems to work rather more reliably.

So you do whatever you like - but expecting W7 and Audition to be a guaranteed bed of roses is a bit of an ask, I'm afraid.

I feel a bit troubled about all this noise as which version of AA/CE is running well under which version of OS. Why not test it yourself ? It is such an easy thing to install a second OS on a sufficiently large HD and run a dual or multiple boot. All may machines have at least a double boot and the pertinent versions of AA installed separately. This is at the same time some kind of emergency. The only restriction I found is AA3.0 not running on any OS below XP.

Like everyone else I can only go by experience.

I have run every MS operating system (not including server OSs) since MSDOS on thousands of different configurations of hardware, both at work and privately. Yes, you can hang on to old hardware and hope that you can run a new OS on it - and really Win 7 does that very well (even on the minimum system spec). I have stuck firmly with Intel and Asus for cpu and motherboard and have never run into the odd problems reported in various fora - I can't claim this is the reason, just that this is the case for me. I have had no driver problems (Mia Midi) that couldn't be solved by a download and all my software runs just fine either in 64B or in 32B mode.

If you already had XP I would agree with Steve about considering whether Win 7 has anything you must have. But as you don't I would ask, have you any reason to go to a basically unsupported OS which you willl have to upgrade eventually anyway. There are usually some hiccups whichever OS you install - I would save myself double pain and go straight to WIn 7.

Oh and I run Win 7 64B

I would ask, have you any reason to go to a basically unsupported OS which you willl have to upgrade eventually anyway. There are usually some hiccups whichever OS you install - I would save myself double pain and go straight to WIn 7.

MS are still providing updates for XP so you can't really claim that it's any more unsupported than any other OS they've produced. The whole point here is that most of the hiccups have already been overcome with it. So, if you want a system that works more or less straight out of the box, then that's what you go for, and that's the consideration that means most to anybody actually using it for a living. And that's also why there are still many, many times more XP installations still running in the world than Vista and W7(all versions) added together, as far as I'm aware. Certainly this week, anyway...

[programs]

The idea of testing Audition on various OS partitions may sound like an interesting idea but it is certainly far too expensive for someone who can’t afford Audition to begin with. Besides, my question was not about Audition per se, but about audio in general on Win 7. There were many reports of audio problems with Vista, most of which seemed to be due to built-in “features.” Have those aspects been dropped in Win 7 or just made to work better? I haven’t had the energy to keep up when I had no expectation of being able to participate.

If money were not an issue, I would have gone with WinXP, knowing I could change whenever I wanted to. As Steve points out, WinXP's stable functionally is much more a known thing. However, my options are not so open and considering the probability that MS will be moving forward rather more than not, and that I might not have an other chance to upgrade for a long time, I decided on Win 7.

It is a little disturbing however that MS’s seems to pitch it purely as an approved way to consume canned entertainment. “Stay on the path! Do not step on the plants!”

If I could have done as I pleased, I would have purchased a current version Intel processor and an Intel chipset MB rather than a $40 reject from 2005. This would even have the possibility of using the Mia that has long been, and still is, in an old box with a 466MHz Celeron and 128MB of RAM.

This “new” computer has an Athalon 64 X2 3800+ and 2GB of 400MHz DDR RAM on a low end ECS MB. However, it was running 64 bit Win 7 Ultimate without any apparent problems. I loaded CE2K and some test files onto it. Based on the program timer, the “Completed in XXX seconds” posted in the lower right hand corner of the program screen, it did NR on a 55 minute recording in slightly less than 1/3 the time required on the Win98 system. Other operations are also considerably faster. I think it can be regarded as a true upgrade rather than just a lateral move, even though it is far below the current norm.

I’ve installed my purchased 64 bit Win 7 Home edition on the new HD I bought it with, retaining the original installation on the other drive for testing purposes until the new setup is fully ready. First I want to get the necessary OS upgrades and some security software but so much of this is very different than what I am used to and understand. Since this isn’t a general computer forum, does anyone have recommendations for a good place to pursue all the questions that are coming up for me?

For a ‘for instance’ start, the OS comes with a firewall. It has dozens of processes listed as being allowed to send data from or receive data into the system. Not a one of them means anything to me. One might suppose things should be alright, since this is the default, but how can I even know if it is safe to dial into the MS site for updates, let alone do anything else?

The firewall I’m using on this Win98 machine works on easily recognized programs. Three program, Internet Explorer, which I haven’t used for years, Firefox, which I use almost daily, and an e-mail program I used to use, are the only things allowed access. Several other programs are listed as not being allowed access because they are the type that want to call home and report on me if the connection happens to be up when I’m using them. The new firewall  isn’t an “upgrade,” it is an entirely different way of doing things. It might be better but it is a rather big step to do overnight without some gradual introduction.

Everything Steve has written, I wholeheartedly agree with.  This is choice between looking forward or having something proven to be trustworthy, which tends to save money, at least in the short term.  Yet I must add a confession to the discussion.

I have skeptically begun playing with Win7 -64, though all my professional work is still in XP, having begun the move because it was a cheap opportunity.

So far, I can't get Audition 3.01 to glitch once with it.  Not that I've done a LOT yet there, but so far it's worked exactly as it always has.  In fact, I think I can even run AA1.5 without difficulties, though I haven't tried stuff like CD extraction (but that's not essential there like it is on my XP work machine).

The beauty of it, and possibly why Win7 is so friendly, is because I'm using a stock motherboard sound chip (it's a GigaByte, nothing extravagent or expensive).  Sounds like a bad idea, right?  Well, though its specs aren't a match for a current pro card (Emu 1616 on the work machine), it's so good I'd love to know, on a test bench, how it stacks up against other "better" stuff.  But the analog side is somewhat moot.  For me, and read this carefully, the addition of a SPDIF I/O card for less than $20 means that my D/A conversion (or vice-versa) can be done on an external receiver, making the sound card's converters irrelevant (though it sounds excellent on cans).  So Andy, you may end up spending a lot of money to ensure compatibility with an old sound card, but the world is moving on.  If you don't want to, and there's no compelling reason why you have to, my advice is to find the cheapest XP solution you can -- go for what you KNOW will work.

If you can afford a little risk (and it doesn't sound like you can), get Win7.  Who knows -- it might cost you nothing extra.  Or a lot.

My advice to anyone NOT already in AA3 is to get it while you can.  It's stable, proven, and really good.  If you buy it now, or sometime prior to the unknown, unannounced release date of the next version of Audition later this Spring, you MIGHT get a free upgrade (that's an ASSUMPTION on my part based on past situations).  Then you'd have two versions of Audition for the price of one.  One can only hope!
.

I somehow don't think Andy will get a useful answer here simply because there are too many variables.

I can point out that most of the problems I've encountered in Windows 7 have been hardware related, but there are some software issues specific to Windows 7 relating to the way the OS interfaces with audio hardware, and I've posted some confusing messages about them elsewhere here.

I think it is essential to ensure that the bios of the machine allows you to enable and disable onboard audio and other devices. This is a serious problem with cheap laptops.

I'm currently following a thread about Windows 7's internal sample rate conversion but haven't had time to carry out any tests myself. See the comments on

http://blog.szynalski.com/2009/11/17/an-audiophiles-look-at-the-audio-stack-in-windows-vista-and-7/

This might not affect people here who will be careful, but they will affect casual users.

Is there any good audio related reason to chose XP over 7?

You should also read this thread - this has been reported before, and is another Microsoft limitation deliberately introduced to attempt to placate the RIAA, and inconvenience legitimate users. And of course it doesn't happen with XP...

I do extract quite a bit from CD every now and then, almost exclusively audio books. This is partly for the purpose of backing up (as mp3) these rather expensive purchases of my daughter’s (although I’ve never actually needed to recreate anything -- yet).

I’ve also been writing the CD contents to cassette for her because audio books are for mobile use and CDs are more difficult  than cassettes to handle. For several years I’ve been attempting to get her to switch to an personal mp3 player, and that might finally be bearing fruit, but the initial DAE will be the same regardless.

However, I’ve never wanted to extract into CoolEdit and can’t think of any reason I would want to extract into Audition, if I can get it. As long as the OS doesn’t interfere with EAC or other DAE programs, there shouldn’t be any problem. Of course MS could always provide such a barrier in an Win 7 update, but they could do the same for WinXP.

I would ask, have you any reason to go to a basically unsupported OS which you willl have to upgrade eventually anyway. There are usually some hiccups whichever OS you install - I would save myself double pain and go straight to WIn 7.

MS are still providing updates for XP so you can't really claim that it's any more unsupported than any other OS they've produced. The whole point here is that most of the hiccups have already been overcome with it. So, if you want a system that works more or less straight out of the box, then that's what you go for, and that's the consideration that means most to anybody actually using it for a living. And that's also why there are still many, many times more XP installations still running in the world than Vista and W7(all versions) added together, as far as I'm aware. Certainly this week, anyway...

For a given value of "using it for a living" maybe, I do and am using Win7 Enterprise  My bad on the updates, I thought they had stopped already, but I stand by the other comments - there are always hiccups installing an OS you haven't used before - as well as a learning curve.  As the OS is already installed I cannot imagine why he shouldn't try out Win7 and devolve to XP if it doesn't work out.

Just read the whole thread.

This makes me think of upgrading from XP to W7. Of course many measures will be taken cared of including if my inter phase works better in W7. I want to thank all for sharing their thoughts. It is very valuable to me.

Thank you so much!