A testament to getting the sound right from the source

[TROGDOR!!!]

Last night a buddy of mine (bassist) and I were working in the studio, and--after several hours of cleaning and rearranging--we decided to lay down some jam tracks just for the fun of it.  So, we found a drum loop (from the fantastic Loopology F-u-n-k & Rock loop set), and then added some electric guitar and bass.  

I've never shown off any of my tracks on here, but this one came together so smoothly with so little work, I thought it deserved to be shared:  Midnight Toad Stomp (don't ask).

The guitar (custom Fat Strat) was run through my Ibanez Tube Screamer into a custom amp setting I created on my Cyber Twin.  We mic'd the cab in front with an Oktava MK-012  about 6" from the right speaker to pick up transients and an MXL 2001 about 6" from the left speaker to add the... well, BALLS.  The bass (Fender Stu Hamm signature model) was run through a DI box direct to the board.

We recorded four guitar tracks (one simple rhythm track, one accent wah track, and two lead tracks which were not originally intended to go together), and one bass track.  We really only did one real take through each track, so there are blatant mistakes, but the sound was set right.

After recording, I spent a grand total of about 10 minutes adjusting pan, EQ, and levels.  I added a bit of tube warmth to the bass and drum tracks with Voxengo's tube plug, but that was the only pre-mix effect.  Post mixdown, I added the echo to the last hit, and used CE's stereo spread effect to give it some width.  A (very) little final EQ, and a .5 dB boost from the hard limiter, and voila!

Comments welcome.

Josh

Where you get dat f u n k.... whiteboy?  

Seriously, that's some nice guitar textures.  Even though you used a "Fat Strat",  some of the guitar parts take on a nice Nugent 57' Birdland tone.  So.. how you digging the 012's?  

Hi 3js,

That was fun to listen to, my friends and I also have Toad stomps in a similiar vein so I had fun listening to you jam.

I like the frequency width you're getting in the mix for low to high - I guess it's really referred to as how 'Tall' the mix is EQ wise.

The rhythm guitar tones sound really good to me in the mix - nice and smooth.

Althought the EQ is pretty tall I can't make out the kick or low end of the bass guitar enough for my liking, a little more definition down there without adding too much more density. I've been working down in there lately around the 2nd and 3rd octave so I'm really listening hard - it's a problem area for me.  

Thanks for sharing - that was fun !  Cool grove too like Voodoo said...

kylen

[TROGDOR!!!]

Thanks guys!

I'm gonna get back in there this week and try a remix, and maybe try a little low-end compression to bring up that kick.  And yeah, I love the 012s!  At first, we tried mic'ing the amp with only the 012s, but the sound was just too thin.  However, combined with a large-diaphragm condenser, we got a pretty sweet sound.

Thanks again for the compliments.

Any more suggestions?

Josh

Hi the3jsgrve,

I forgot to mention earlier. You've done 98% of the work - creating, recording, mixing, etc. All this commentary is just the last 2 cents !

I'm thinking it might be better to 'sweep' for the kick with a parametric and when you find it - maybe around 75-85Hz just try bumping the peak  up a bit maybe even a little lower like at 60Hz just a dB or so (peaking EQ set to an octave bandwidth).

The density sounds pretty good down there so I thought just pinpointing the kick would bring it up a touch, along with the low end of the bass. I'm afraid if you compress it to bring it up it would ruin your beautiful EQ range you already have established by making it denser than necessary.

kylen

[TROGDOR!!!]

Thanks man!  I'll try that out.

You guys should clean and rearrange more often!  Hey, this isn't my musical language, but it's obvious that something was working right here...

The guitar sounds great.  And I too would have liked a little more depth and punch on the bottom (the bass isn't really all that low, so there's a limit here to what can be done with that) and occasionally felt like the lead lines fought each other -- but for 10 minutes for the mix, well, that's just extremely fine.

...a little more depth and punch on the bottom (the bass isn't really all that low, so there's a limit here to what can be done with that)

OK MusicConductor well said - that's some good advice there ! It's more a depth and punch thing...

As far as the lead guitar - occasionally it was snipping at my 2.5K(?) cochlea resonator - I wasn't sure if it was just a composition thing (too much of a good thing) or a compression thing...

Anyway fun was had by all- jammers & reviewers !

kylen

It sounds really good here, 'specially the bass coming thru the sub-woofers. Kinda of like the jams we used to do years ago. I would suggest adding a bass solo part, and maybe even a drum solo, then maybe, look for a cover song to go into, and turn it into one really long jam. Good opening song though !!! Great effort !!

[TROGDOR!!!]

Thanks for the tips all!  You know, I had really just intended to make this a fun project for the sole purpose of testing out my new mics, but I may just have to do something more with it.

As far as the lead guitar - occasionally it was snipping at my 2.5K(?) cochlea resonator - I wasn't sure if it was just a composition thing (too much of a good thing) or a compression thing...

Yeah, I noticed some of that snipping in my car stereo...  I think it's from the "little final EQ" that I added post mix as the non-EQ'd mix doesn't do that.  I will see what I can do with it later this week.

Thanks for all the advice guys!  I'll certainly take all I can get!

Josh

Then there's the new Led Zep DVD I just listened too again, the bass envelope doesn't have any kick drum definition in there much of the time (1st disk) but it still sounds great as a component of the other things making up the mix.

This is the thing I'm working at right now - getting the depth and punch from a mix. Some times it comes from the bass guitar other time from the kick - it all depends on how the recording and mix was intended to position each instrument.

Sometimes too much 'forced' definition puts a little too much density down in there. I guess sometimes warmth is all it takes - that's what I liked about your bottom end in the first place, ah - musically speaking!  

kylen

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I love that Led Zep DVD!  I bought it a couple of weeks ago.  There is not much better than sittin back with a cold one and a couple of friends and enjoying 5 1/2 hrs of live footage of the greatest rock band ever!

An mp3 of the live version of "Black Dog" is available from mp3.com for anyone interested.  Excellent performance!

Josh

[TROGDOR!!!]

How's this:  Midnight Toad Stomp 3?

I worked on pulling up the kick drum and flattening some of the problem frequencies.

Tell me what you think?  Any further suggestions?

Thanks!

Josh