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coOLEDItor Posts: 10	Posted - Thu May 01, 2003 10:47 pm  ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- -------------------------------------> Quality Tutorial <---------------------------------------- 1.Open your instrumental on the first track in multi-track view. You want to keep all of your files organized when recording an audio to make things easier on yourself. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2. Move down to the 2nd track then click the red "R" button when you are ready to record your vocals. Once you've done this you want to silence areas that you are not vocalizing over. E.G.If you have a break or pause in the middle of your verse, silence it. Don't silence like half a second places though. Delete the areas immediatly before and after your vocals also. Click EFFECTS->Silence ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3. After you record your vocals, you want to get rid of all that feedback and static. You want to run a Noice Reduction. Click EFFECTS->Noise Reduction->Noice Reduction->Get Profile From Selection Then you want to insert a number in the area where it says "Reduce By ___ dB". The number that you insert will change for every verse you do. I suggest you do no lower than 10 and no higher than 35. After you insert a number, "Preview" what you did. Lower the number if you hear a sort of robotic noise in your high vocals. You just have to play with it sort of. Get it to were it cuts out a lot of the noise but doesn't have the robotic "ssss" feedback in it. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4.Leveling of your vocals... You want your vocals to be one level threw out your verse. To do this you want to do this step: Click EFFECTS->Amplitude->Dynamics Processing CHOOSE "RealAudio Compander". This will level off your vocals. This is one of the more important things of the tutorial. This one gives you a brighter sound. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5.Mic Modeler.... This is the best DirectX plug-in that I know of... You will need to download and Install/set-up this plug-in to use it. Download it here http://www.antarestech.com/downloads/Mic_Modeler_DX_v1.30.exe once installed simply find the best mic that compliments your vocals.. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6.Normalize... Click EFFECTS->Amplitude->Normalize This will just increase the volume of you vocals evenly. I recommend raising them 65%. If this is to low when you play back your vocals, just adjust the volume on the multi-track section... ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 7.Warm-tone... this is the 2nd plug-in you will need.... This is another great plug-in... It warms your vocals....download it here http://www.aipl.com/download/Warm.exe Once you install it...enter these numbers from left to right... 0, 34, 6, 250, 73, 0. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9.Light reverb EFFECTS->Delay Effects->Reverb CHOOSE tight and close (definitely compliments any vocal) ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 10.ANOTHER Light reverb EFFECTS->Delay Effects->Reverb CHOOSE Vocal- NICE Presence (again definitely compliments any vocal) ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11.Studio Voice EFFECTS->Filters->Parametric Equalizer Click the link below... and then enter the EXACT settings as in the picture... http://capheine0.tripod.com/part3b-parametric.gif ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12.If you got alot of hiss in the backround of your vocals follow this step (this depends on your mic not everyone has to do this step) EFFECTS->NOISE REDUCTION->HISS REDUCTION CHOOSE STANDARD HISS REDUCTION ----------------------------------------------------------------------- 13.The final step(s)...listen to your vocals... if you have parts where you are to low or to high... then you need to this... EFFECTS->Filters->Graphic Equalizer If it's too low....CHOOSE 'simple bass lift' if its too high....CHOOSE 'simple high cut' you'll need to do this more than once... depends on how much is too high or too low...
post78 Location: USA Posts: 2887	Posted - Thu May 01, 2003 11:07 pm  Um... I have a serious problem with EVERY SINGLE STEP listed here. I sincerely hope that nobody takes this "tutorial" seriously. _________________ Answer = 1. Probably.
coOLEDItor Posts: 10	Posted - Thu May 01, 2003 11:13 pm  AND WHAT EXACTLY IS YOUR PROBLEM? try it i gurantee u'll always use this method for your vocals.Just do a test and then say u got a problem okay there "SMART-GUY"
jonrose Location: USA Posts: 2901	Posted - Thu May 01, 2003 11:28 pm  Although I can appreciate the probable intent of this posting, it's not really something that could possibly apply to all vocal work, and maybe not much vocal work at all. Or maybe no vocal work... Why? Most any good vocal starts with a good recording. And all good recordings start with good voices, knowledge of the voice's strengths and weaknesses and how to make the best use of them, good voice control, good microphone technique; Also necessary are a decent microphone, a fairly clean preamp, and a decent audio card installed in the computer (assuming computer recording, of course), and an environment conducive to obtaining a good recording. Simple room treatments and getting the computer case out of the sonic space can go a long way toward this end. Noise reduction just shouldn't be necessary. Fewer processing steps are always best, on any track. This seems like a lot of work for what might have been better served with less processing. An objective analysis of what the vocal actually needs in order to sit properly in a particular mix (prior to doing anything to it) is always best. But, of course, that's just my take on it. ;) Best... -Jon P.S. And, I don't think a defensive attitude helps to get your point across. This is a place of learning - not a place for a flame war. _________________
DeluXMan Location: Canada Posts: 330	Posted - Thu May 01, 2003 11:33 pm  use the "real-audio compander" huh?
Bobbsy Location: United Kingdom Posts: 327	Posted - Fri May 02, 2003 7:16 am  A little knowledge is a dangerous thing...to coin a cliche. Bob
Gulliver Location: Estonia Posts: 442	Posted - Fri May 02, 2003 7:29 am  DeluXMan wrote: use the "real-audio compander" huh? You may laugh as loud as you wish... but I use this preset for compressing voice-overs (or other similar recordings of voice for radio ads) almost always and it works great. I don't use it for any vocals in songs though...
Graeme Member Location: Spain Posts: 4663	Posted - Fri May 02, 2003 10:46 am  coOLEDItor wrote: AND WHAT EXACTLY IS YOUR PROBLEM? His 'problem' is essentially the same as mine - the bulk of your post is crock of crap and about as much use as a fart in a thunderstorm to anyone trying to really understand the recording process. I suggest you read through the forum archives beore committing yurself in this way again. You'll find there are some real experts here - something which you patently are not - all of whom would disagree with virtually every statement you made. Anyone reading this thread and who is trying to record good vocal tracks would be well-advised to ignore coOLEDItor's advice, wholesale! _________________ Graeme Don't forget to join the new CEP forum at audiomastersforum
groucho Posts: 334	Posted - Fri May 02, 2003 11:05 am  Heh, when I first read coOLEDItor's "Quality Tutorial" I honestly assumed it was a joke. Had a good laugh too. I'm still not totally convinced it isn't tongue-in-cheek, but judging from his previous posts it looks more likely that this guy's just a troll. I still can't believe anyone would post that with serious intent. But I've been wrong before... Chris
post78 Location: USA Posts: 2887	Posted - Fri May 02, 2003 2:14 pm  I tried to reply to this last night, but after I hit send I suddenly could no longer get to the Syntrillium site, anywhere. It's a good thing I copied it as I do all of my replies (just until I know it's posted), because it was a long one. It seems that I don't need to reply because others have chimed in with my thoughts (especially Graeme), but it took me a while, so I'm going to post it up anyway. It will be in two parts because, well, I can't live without this forum! _________________ Answer = 1. Probably.
post78 Location: USA Posts: 2887	Posted - Fri May 02, 2003 2:19 pm  Quote: ...okay there "SMART-GUY" Okay there "sOMetimEs-cAPITal-LetTERs-gUY". I don't need to try your method, because I've been doing this long enough to know that it's complete garbage, and it will guaranteed diminish signal quality. You might think I'm being a jerk, but frankly, I don't care. This type of information is dangerous to people who don't know any better. For example, I wouldn't be surprised if you learned most of this from the internet, from people that don't know any better. I will never use this method for my vocals, so your guarantee is broken. What do I win? Quote: AND WHAT EXACTLY IS YOUR PROBLEM? Well, as much as I wish this thread never happened in the first place, I suppose I asked for this, so: 1. Okay, I don't have a problem with number one. I'm all for organization. But you should know that a large number of users here will be dealing with much more than a simple instrumental. That point aside, here are your real problems: Quote: 2. Once you've done this you want to silence areas that you are not vocalizing over. Why? Here's a tip: If you can't give a valid reason for why something should be done, you shouldn't claim that it should be done. There are times when you might want areas to be silenced, which is why a gate is often used on vocals. But, there are also times where you want to keep things going on in the background. Actually, a vocal take should be done in such a way that this isn't even necessary! If it's a big problem for you, consider altering your recording technique. Quote: 3. After you record your vocals, you want to get rid of all that feedback and static. You want to run a Noice Reduction. What feedback and static? Noise reduction is the LAST thing anybody should be placing on their vocals. The voice is usually the most prominent part of a mix, and if you go sticking noise reduction where it doesn't belong, it's going to destroy your entire mix! Again, you need to figure out why you're even getting feedback and static in the first place. Quote: The ["Reduce By ___ dB"] number that you insert will change for every verse you do. Again, why? Are you suggesting that every verse be done one different takes? And even if so, why are the "feedback and static" levels so drastically different from take to take? Quote: I suggest you do no lower than 10 and no higher than 35. A suggestion is fine; here's a good one: I suggest not using noise reduction unless it's absolutely necessary, and even then, use as little as possible to receive satisfactory results. Here's a good place to insert Voodoo's first law of noise reduction: "Noise reduction works best on signals with.... very little noise!" Quote: 4.Leveling of your vocals... You want your vocals to be one level threw out your verse. Perhaps you want this, but any engineer that cares about quality and emotion will most certainly not. Take away dynamics and you're left with a bored audience. Quote: CHOOSE "RealAudio Compander". Well, here's our first preset. How do you know that every voice, or even every vocal take will sound best with this preset? And if it does, than why are you getting such drastically different "feedback and static" results between verses? Of the same voice!? Quote: This one (still on #4) gives you a brighter sound. How? Quote: 5.Mic Modeler...once installed simply find the best mic that compliments your vocals.. Again, why? What was wrong with the microphone that I actually used to record the voice in the first place? _________________ Answer = 1. Probably.
post78 Location: USA Posts: 2887	Posted - Fri May 02, 2003 2:22 pm  Quote: 6.Normalize...I recommend raising them 65%. If this is to low when you play back your vocals, just adjust the volume on the multi-track section... Absolutely pointless. First, using any sort of transform will degrade audio quality. Whether or not it's audible is completely beside the point once it involves things that don't need to be done. Second, your levels should remain as close to full scale as possible without clipping, and 65% is not even close. If working in 32-bit float, noise isn't an issue, but this is still beside the point when, once again, it's not necessary! Third, as you've already stated, "just adjust the volume [in] the multi-track section"! Criminy... How many "why"s am I going to have to ask during this reply? Quote: 7.Warm-tone... this is the 2nd plug-in you will need.... Here we go... Why? What if my vocals are already warm enough? What if I don't want them to be warm at all? What if the warmth I'm looking for can't be found in this plug-in? Quote: Once you install it...enter these numbers from left to right... 0, 34, 6, 250, 73, 0. Again with the presets... Same questions as above. Quote: 9.Light reverb...CHOOSE tight and close (definitely compliments any vocal) Yet again: Why? What if my vocal take doesn't need reverb? For example; the room I was in had a great sound, so I added a couple of room mic's to pick up the natural reverberant characteristics of that room. Or, perhaps the sound I'm going for is dry, and adding reverb will simply destroy any hopes to achieve my goal. And again, why that preset? What if another one is better? What if it compliments your vocal but insults my vocal? And by the way, what ever happened to number 8? Quote: 10.ANOTHER Light reverb CHOOSE Vocal- NICE Presence (again definitely compliments any vocal) To simplify this, combine parts of my responses from numbers 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, and 9. (There would probably be an "8", except that it doesn't exist.) Quote: 11.Studio Voice...EFFECTS->Filters->Parametric Equalizer...Click the link below... and then enter the EXACT settings as in the picture... What if my voice doesn't need EQ? And if it did, why would the settings in that picture make it sound better, instead of worse? You already know how I feel about the presets. Quote: 12.If you got alot of hiss in the backround of your vocals... Well Hell! We probably do now that we've just completely destroyed our take with all of these other steps! I guess that if someone actually does steps "2" though "11" (minus "8"), than I don't really have a problem with this one... Quote: 13.The final step(s)...listen to your vocals... if you have parts where you are to low or to high... then you need to this... EFFECTS->Filters->Graphic Equalizer If it's too low....CHOOSE 'simple bass lift' if its too high....CHOOSE 'simple high cut' you'll need to do this more than once... depends on how much is too high or too low... Dangit, I'm too tired of this to keep going. Problems with number 13 can be found in the rest of them, except for number "8". _________________ Answer = 1. Probably.
VoodooRadio Location: USA Posts: 3971	Posted - Fri May 02, 2003 3:10 pm  Quote: quote: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 12.If you got alot of hiss in the backround of your vocals... -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Well Hell! We probably do now that we've just completely destroyed our take with all of these other steps! I guess that if someone actually does steps "2" though "11" (minus "8"), than I don't really have a problem with this one... ROTFFLMAO!!! I must admit, I too actually thought it was a "joke", but I think he's serious. All I can say is... post some of your work somewhere and let us all share in it's "magic"! _________________ I said Good Day! Voodoo
twright Location: USA Posts: 230	Posted - Fri May 02, 2003 3:32 pm  post78 wrote: Quote: 12.If you got alot of hiss in the backround of your vocals... Well Hell! We probably do now that we've just completely destroyed our take with all of these other steps! I guess that if someone actually does steps "2" though "11" (minus "8"), than I don't really have a problem with this one... i almost choked from laughing at post's reply. good stuff post!
SteveG Location: United Kingdom Posts: 6695	Posted - Fri May 02, 2003 4:12 pm  I'm surprised that this guy has a spare hand left to click a mouse button... _________________
VoodooRadio Location: USA Posts: 3971	Posted - Fri May 02, 2003 5:43 pm  Quote: 13.The final step(s)...listen to your vocals... if you have parts where you are to low or to high... then you need to this... EFFECTS->Filters->Graphic Equalizer If it's too low....CHOOSE 'simple bass lift' if its too high....CHOOSE 'simple high cut' you'll need to do this more than once... depends on how much is too high or too low... This step kinda reminds me of the "Anti-Drug" commercial. You know the one where they have this guy in an asylum walking in circles in a little room. The voice over is saying... "I gotta work more hours, to make more money, to buy more drugs, so I can work more hours, to make more money, to buy more drugs, so I can ....... you get the picture. I can see Kewl-editer now, hovered over his system.... "Man, still too low, lift the bass.... man, still too low, lift the bass.... man, still too low......................... I have to say, it has been good for a laugh, but that's all it's worth!! _________________ I said Good Day! Voodoo
geraco Posts: 3	Posted - Fri May 02, 2003 6:29 pm  Quote: try it i gurantee u'll always use this method for your vocals.Just do a test and then say u got a problem This could be the missing #8 LOL Later.
geraco Posts: 3	Posted - Fri May 02, 2003 6:32 pm  Quote: try it i gurantee u'll always use this method for your vocals.Just do a test and then say u got a problem This could be the missing #8. LOL Later.
Emmett Location: USA Posts: 59	Posted - Sat May 03, 2003 2:01 pm  ---> Quality Tutorial <--- 1. Get the best equipment 2. Record at 24 bit with a high sample rate 3. Do as little to alter the recording as Possible 4. If adjustments need to be made, use your ears 5. Do not listen to coOLEDItor _________________ Emmett KPNT, St. Louis, MO
VoodooRadio Location: USA Posts: 3971	Posted - Sat May 03, 2003 3:01 pm  That sounds bout right to me, Emmett. And, regardless of the quality of #1 OR a person's ability to perform #4..... I guarantee you'll get better results if you heed #5. _________________ I said Good Day! Voodoo
post78 Location: USA Posts: 2887	Posted - Sat May 03, 2003 3:21 pm  _________________ Answer = 1. Probably.
VoodooRadio Location: USA Posts: 3971	Posted - Sat May 03, 2003 4:54 pm  I thought you'd like that Jeremiah!! _________________ I said Good Day! Voodoo
Mark T Location: Norway Posts: 890	Posted - Mon May 05, 2003 12:57 am  SteveG wrote: I'm surprised that this guy has a spare hand left to click a mouse button... LOL - what tweezers in one hand, magnifying glass in the other? _________________ Mark nil desperandum - nunc est bibendum
coOLEDItor Posts: 10	Posted - Mon May 05, 2003 10:15 am  o.k this is the only song i used this method on and it gave me excellant quality in my mind so go to your media player then file-> open URL -> (then paste this in there)http://www.soundclick.com/util/streamM3U.m3u?ID=327848&q=Lo first it's a lady singing i sampled it from a movie "set it off" then i go first i made the beat and then the second dude is MATIKULUZ so just listen and tell me u don't like the quality alright
zemlin Location: USA Posts: 1156	Posted - Mon May 05, 2003 11:57 am  coOLEDItor wrote: so just listen and tell me u don't like the quality alright Silly me, I thought you were talking about making music. Is the distortion something you added, the result of a lousy recording, or the outcome of your "process"? _________________ Karl Zemlin - www.cheap-tracks.com Host of the World Wide Cool Edit Collaboration Procedural Debate
VoodooRadio Location: USA Posts: 3971	Posted - Mon May 05, 2003 12:04 pm  Quote: just listen... I did. Quote: ...and tell me u don't like the quality I don't like the quality. WoW! That was easy with you telling me what to do. Thanks!! _________________ I said Good Day! Voodoo
groucho Posts: 334	Posted - Mon May 05, 2003 12:23 pm  Okay, now I'm *sure* this is a gag. Chris
SteveG Location: United Kingdom Posts: 6695	Posted - Mon May 05, 2003 1:40 pm  Mark T wrote: SteveG wrote: I'm surprised that this guy has a spare hand left to click a mouse button... LOL - what tweezers in one hand, magnifying glass in the other? Come on, Mark - you know full well what I mean! I was merely suggesting that he got his 'recording tips' manual from the top shelf in W.H.Smiths. (Sorry to those in the US, but this is an oblique UK reference that I'm sure that Mark will appreciate...) _________________
jonrose Location: USA Posts: 2901	Posted - Tue May 06, 2003 12:28 am  groucho wrote: Okay, now I'm *sure* this is a gag. Well, Chris, I have to admit that I certainly gagged on it... _________________
groucho Posts: 334	Posted - Tue May 06, 2003 1:11 am  coOLEDItor wrote: o.k this is the only song i used this method on and it gave me excellant quality in my mind... I think those last three words are the key here. I want the drugs this dude's on... Chris "It all goes down in your mind" -Johnny Cash
Mark T Location: Norway Posts: 890	Posted - Tue May 06, 2003 4:01 am  SteveG wrote: Mark T wrote: SteveG wrote: I'm surprised that this guy has a spare hand left to click a mouse button... LOL - what tweezers in one hand, magnifying glass in the other? Come on, Mark - you know full well what I mean! I was merely suggesting that he got his 'recording tips' manual from the top shelf in W.H.Smiths. (Sorry to those in the US, but this is an oblique UK reference that I'm sure that Mark will appreciate...) Of course I understood, the magnifying glass is to study the fine detail in the ahem, manual, and the tweezers are for....em....hang on I'll think of something:D _________________ Mark nil desperandum - nunc est bibendum
VoodooRadio Location: USA Posts: 3971	Posted - Tue May 06, 2003 5:06 am  I laughed so hard, my ribs are still sore two days later. :P _________________ I said Good Day! Voodoo
ROBSCIX Posts: 254	Posted - Mon May 19, 2003 7:55 pm  Very Harsh guys, but after reading entire post I guess a little bit of ribbing is in order. lol
Caleb Posts: 93	Posted - Tue May 20, 2003 10:37 am  Ok, I listened.. My personal opinion is that it sounds about the same as what you get when you use two tin cans and a long string as a phone..now granted, its a very processed digital string, but still.. If this is the sound you dig, then more power to you.. most of us spend a long time trying to find "the sound", and as far as I am concerned... Thats not it _________________ Caleb
SteveG Location: United Kingdom Posts: 6695	Posted - Tue May 20, 2003 10:50 am  Mark T wrote: Of course I understood, the magnifying glass is to study the fine detail in the ahem, manual, and the tweezers are for....em....hang on I'll think of something:D This is why I was getting a little confused. I have no idea what the tweezers could be for, unless it's splinters... and I can't see what good a magnifying glass is going to do, because according to one old wives's tale he should be going blind! _________________
jonrose Location: USA Posts: 2901	Posted - Tue May 20, 2003 11:48 am  "Say, could I interest you in a pair of zircon-encrusted tweezers?" -Frank Zappa _________________
Caleb Posts: 93	Posted - Tue May 20, 2003 5:55 pm  Maybe some of that instant "warmth" paste I mean the stuff you put on transistors.. sickos8) _________________ Caleb
Gambino Posts: 27	Posted - Sat May 24, 2003 10:55 pm  well cooledit guy... i just dont know y syntrillium hasnt hired you yet... i just listened to your song, and i just have 3 things to say.... 1.- stop using the shower as a recording booth.... 2.- tell whoever that is rapping to stop rapping thru the cardboard tube in the middle of a toilet paper roll... 3.- if you insist on recording in the shower with a toilet paper roll, at least make sure the shower is off!
Mark T Location: Norway Posts: 890	Posted - Mon May 26, 2003 1:37 am  SteveG wrote: Mark T wrote: Of course I understood, the magnifying glass is to study the fine detail in the ahem, manual, and the tweezers are for....em....hang on I'll think of something:D This is why I was getting a little confused. I have no idea what the tweezers could be for, unless it's splinters... and I can't see what good a magnifying glass is going to do, because according to one old wives's tale he should be going blind! Well, I was allowing for a deterioration of eyesight before full blindness sets in, the tweezers are obviously for manipulating something very small, now what could that be (no not his brain;)) _________________ Mark nil desperandum - nunc est bibendum
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