Syntrillium Backup Forums :: View topic - To Syntrillium Support: Memory management

Dausenkunz · Location: Germany

Hi,
This is related to the more memory thread.
I (Like many others) have recently upgraded my computer to 512 MB Now I would like to know:
- Can I speed up processing by loading the whole soundfile into memory?
- if Yes, can it be achieved through the Cool edit system settings or will I have to install a ram-disk?

Thanks

Andreas

Syntrillium Support · Location: USA

>> Can I speed up processing by loading the whole sound file into memory?

Though we have not tested this, it would make sense that it would help speed up "editing". But it will NOT speed up the transforms. If you are doing lots of cutting and pasting and CEP is constantly creating undo files, it would speedup the process of cutting and pasting. It would also help with multitrack's background mixing.

All transforms such as reverb and noise reduction use CPU and some RAM. So a RAM disk won't speed-up the processing of transforms since Cool Edit does not use HD to process transforms.

>> if Yes, can it be achieved through the Cool edit system settings or will I have to install a ram-disk?

NO, Cool Edit has no RAM disk feature and it cannot put its temp folder in the ram without ram disk. So you will have to use some kind of 3rd party ram disk software.

NOTES:
Syntrillium does NOT recommend using ram disk as your temp folder. We have done no testing in this area and do not know if it works. It could destroy your audio projects for all we know.

If you decide to create RAM disk and make CEP use it, you have to tell CEP to use the newly created RAM disk as its temp folder (Options > Settings > System). This is the only way to make CEP use the ram disk.

Also, you should not use RAM disk if your combined project (session and wavefile size) is larger than 50 MB. Because Cool Edit relies heavily on HD for its processing, you will quickly run out of RAM disk and we don't know how well CEP can move to the secondary temp folder (when dealing with RAM disk as the primary temp folder).

WARNING:
Again, Syntrillium does NOT recommend RAM Disk.
Using RAM Disk disables Cool Edit's Crash recover feature since the file exists in the RAM and will be gone as soon as you shut down or reboot your PC.

Maximum RAM:
2 Gigs or 512 MB RAM limitation?
Although Windows 95, 98, ME can use up to 2 Gigs of RAM, it may start acting strangely and may start crashing randomly when a machine has more than 512 MB RAM. So do not upgrade your RAM to more than 512 MB until you understand all the side effects and how to work around it. Here are a few links on this topic:

http://support.microsoft.com/support/kb/articles/Q253/9/12.ASP

http://support.microsoft.com/support/kb/articles/q181/5/94.asp

Is RAM Disk really worth it?
Most Cool Edit users have windows 98 or ME and therefore should not have more than 512 MB RAM in their system (open to debate).

You should give at least 128 MB of RAM to your OS for fast and reliable processing.
You are now left with 384 MB of Ram to turn into a RAM Disk.

This is not alot of RAM when dealing with audio files. Keep in mind that a 1 minute audio file uses 10 MB of HD space at (44100 Stereo 16-bit); 21 MB if you are dealing with a 32-bit file. By default Cool Edit is set to 32-bit background processing (21MB HD space for 1 minute session). Each time you load a file that is not a native Cool Edit file, Cool Edit creates a copy of the file in the temp folder.

Example:
Lets say you have a session that has 8 tracks and each wave file is about 3 minutes long and your entire session is about 6 minute long. Since you need to work with these files in other applications, you saved the file in 32-bit .24bit float (not a native CEP format). Therefore, each file is 21 MB/min which means one 3 minute file = 66 MB. 66 MB x 8 waves/tracks = 528 MB.
Oops. You are over 384 MB of your RAM disk.

So you say, "Wait."
My files are in 32-bit 16.8 float (native to CEP).
OK you open your session and CEP does not have to create a temp file until you edit your files.
As soon as you open your session, CEP creates a background mix (for the session).
Since your session is 6 minutes and the premix is set to 32-bit, it will require 126 MB to build the background mix. Now you are down to 258 MB. Lets say you decide to hard limit all your files. As explained before, that needs 528 MB for undo purposes. Now you only have 258 MB left.

So you say, "Wait."
My files are in 16-bit file format. So they only take 10 MB/minute. (well, actually 10.33 MB)
10.33MB x 3minutes = 34 MB x 8 waves/tracks = 272 + 126 for premix = 398 MB for session and waves.
oops. You are over 384 MB of your RAM disk.

So you say, "Wait."
My files are in 16-bit format, my background session premix is in 16-bit format and I don’t want to edit files.
OK
272 + 63 for premix = 335 MB
384 - 335 = 49 MB Ram disk free. Great. You got 49 MB of RAM Disk to work with. But wait. You have to mix down your session to save it. The session is 6 minutes and you are mixing it down to 44100 stereo 16-bit. OK, that needs 62 MB (10.33 x 6).
Oops. That’s more than 48 MB left in the RAM disk.

So you say, "Wait."
My session only has 4 wave files instead of 8. OK then CEP’s background mix is going to take almost the same amount of time on HD vs RAM. So there is not that much advantage in using RAM Disk in such situation.

So you say, "Wait."
I don’t even use the MT view. In fact I have CE2000 without the Studio Plugin. I simply do wave file editing (no multitrack work). And I never open more than one file at a time. But the files are 20 minutes long and I do lots of edits and each edit requires CEP to create an Undo.
OK.
So your file is 20 Minutes long x 10.33 MB/Min = 207 MB
You have 384 MB of RAM to work with (remember, you gave 128 MB to Windows so you no longer have 512MB).
You start with normalizing the whole file. CEP creates an undo file.
384 - 207 = 177 MB of RAM disk left.
You decide to do a noise reduction on the file.
Oops. You have only 177 MB left and another undo requires 207 MB.

So you say, "Wait."
I have my undo disabled. Cool Edit doesn’t even create an undo!!!
Ok, then what’s the problem? It’s HD access you were trying limit by using RAM Disk.
If you don’t use undo, then CEP will work almost at the same speed using HD as temp folder vs RAM Disk as temp folder.
…

You get the idea. It is just not worth it. Audio files require lots of HD space for processing. The RAM disk is not widely used and we don’t really know its ramifications when used in this manor. Sound like a good idea at first, but when it comes right down to it, it is not worth the effort.

I’m not saying there is no place for RAM Disk in the digital audio editing realm. Of course there is. But only for a few expert users who know and understand all the limitations and are careful not to over step.

To sum up, first please re-read the first 2 paragraphs. Remember, the purpose of using RAM Disk was to limit Cool Edit’s access to the HD and to have Cool Edit use RAM instead of HD. This is not advantageous to transforms in any way. This may only help editing speed and background mixing speed (and that’s open to discussion as per the above explanation).

Perhaps it will make sense when more people are using Windows 2000 and XP, as well as each machine having 4 gigs of RAM. Lets re-visit this topic again in a year.

--Syntrillium Support

jonrose · Location: USA

Hi there, Synt!

Dausenkunz · Location: Germany

Wow, thanks to Synt for the elaborate answer and to John for the important additions.

I think I´ll go for the Ram-disk despite all the warnings.
I am currently working on an audio restoration project. I´ll only work on stereo tracks of 3-5 minutes length. So I think that the 300 MB will be sufficient for that.

Andreas

PS: Thanks for the hint about cool edits native 32bit format. I did not know that before.

Dausenkunz · Location: Germany

Ok,
I´ve tried it and my verdict is:
You were right - it is really not worth the hassle. The 256MB Ramdisk was full in no time and I did not even notice a difference in speed when Cool switched to the second temp directory on the HD.

Andreas

jonrose · Location: USA

Well, I didn't think anyone would really jump on that wagon so fast, so I'll make an ammendment or two...

First, I'm glad to hear you didn't have any problems, Andreas. And as Synt noted, you quickly found the limitations.

But if you do have another networked machine, with LOTS of ram installed, along with a very FAST network connection, you could try the remote ramdisk I mentioned.

However, I will eat some of my words here: Contrary to my prior statement (in the above post), you would need a third-party ram disk driver for anything quite as large as I mentioned in my postscript. Unfortunately, the Microshaft version is fairly limited in its maximum size.

Also of note is this fact;
Microshaft says Windoze ME does not even support a ram disk. But that's really only because their driver is a real-mode device. I guess they don't consider it a viable solution for anything beyond using it on their boot diskette. Too bad!

But then again, Microshlock has never really catered to power-user set, anyway.
"Thanks for nothing, Bill..."

All the best.... -Jon
:-)

TheSeeker · Posted - Sat Oct 06, 2001 3:35 pm

How does this apply to Win 2000 dual processor system with 1 gig of ram?

Any future plans to add multiprocessor support to CEP?